Park wait time rants

[Wisco Woody]

The Goliath crew today, and on many days, is absolutely terrible at their jobs, and the wait times are unnecessarily longer by a wide margin. On their premier thrill coaster alongside the Bull, they should have ride ops at least as competent as they do on Bull.

[CoasterDemon]

CD, Thanks for explaining this.

My pleasure! This is important for everyone to understand, not just in our hobby.

Hopefully the system is not abused.

Unfortunately, people still find ways to abuse it. Yesterday, a security guard told me he is stationed at the Goliath exit/ADA entry to intercept people who "forge a time." For example, the wait time between rides for ADA folks was 50 minutes yesterday. Someone who rode Demon at 5:55 takes a pen and writes over the 2nd 5, attempting to change that time to 5:05, so they can nab a "free ride." This is the most common problem, to my knowledge, once a pass is obtained.

These people have their passes taken away, and are walked to Guest Relations to be told not to get a pass again... or something of that sort. The ADA passes are all put in their system with your name (you have to show ID), and you are assigned an ADA number for all of the Six Flags parks. If you do something to violate the terms (like attempting to change a time, for example), it could lead to you having the benefit removed. I'm sure someone else, who absolutely know exactly how it works, could explain it better than me.

Please see my comments about people running and jumping to get on the ride, as well as the teen girl with the neoprene knee brace. Those are the folks that I'm talking about, possibly abusing the system.

I'll make this a little easier to explain, by first telling you that I use an ADA pass. I can run, jump, leap, and maybe still do a front roll down a lawn. You cannot tell who needs it and who doesn't.

There is a broad spectrum (continuum?) of abilities and frequencies with difficulties navigating the world; it can be as varied as the number of people who need the pass (and whom get it legally). I get around the issues I have problems with fairly well. But once in a while I have a problem. So it is my best interest to get the pass when I'm at the park.

[Wisco Woody]

Also, both Viper and Eagle Red are closed for the whole day, which is thus ruined.

[maxwellt]

Yeah that sucked, but viper is going backwards, as for the Goliath crew, yes very bad, but they're really making sure seatbelts are on, remember over Texas a few years ago.....

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[CoasterRiderSC]

The Goliath crew today, and on many days, is absolutely terrible at their jobs, and the wait times are unnecessarily longer by a wide margin. On their premier thrill coaster alongside the Bull, they should have ride ops at least as competent as they do on Bull.

I totally agree with the Goliath crew comment. One thing that kind of irks me is that they wait kind of long to let the next group of people into the lines which delays the sending of the train. I don't know why they do that.
And I've seen plenty of trains with 2 or more open seats. That should never happen with the SRL.

[CoasterRiderSC]

CD, Thanks for explaining this.

My pleasure! This is important for everyone to understand, not just in our hobby.

Hopefully the system is not abused.

Unfortunately, people still find ways to abuse it. Yesterday, a security guard told me he is stationed at the Goliath exit/ADA entry to intercept people who "forge a time." For example, the wait time between rides for ADA folks was 50 minutes yesterday. Someone who rode Demon at 5:55 takes a pen and writes over the 2nd 5, attempting to change that time to 5:05, so they can nab a "free ride." This is the most common problem, to my knowledge, once a pass is obtained.

These people have their passes taken away, and are walked to Guest Relations to be told not to get a pass again... or something of that sort. The ADA passes are all put in their system with your name (you have to show ID), and you are assigned an ADA number for all of the Six Flags parks. If you do something to violate the terms (like attempting to change a time, for example), it could lead to you having the benefit removed. I'm sure someone else, who absolutely know exactly how it works, could explain it better than me.

Please see my comments about people running and jumping to get on the ride, as well as the teen girl with the neoprene knee brace. Those are the folks that I'm talking about, possibly abusing the system.

I'll make this a little easier to explain, by first telling you that I use an ADA pass. I can run, jump, leap, and maybe still do a front roll down a lawn. You cannot tell who needs it and who doesn't.

There is a broad spectrum (continuum?) of abilities and frequencies with difficulties navigating the world; it can be as varied as the number of people who need the pass (and whom get it legally). I get around the issues I have problems with fairly well. But once in a while I have a problem. So it is my best interest to get the pass when I'm at the park.

Thanks again for explaining this and giving me the other point of view on the ADA pass. It's good that you're able to get this so you can enjoy all the rides!

[CoasterDemon]

^You bet! I get the pass, but if the line is short, I wait in it. I'm good for a bit, but I really need that back up. I started getting the pass in 2011, but before that there were times I had to leave the park after an hour.

[Dan The Coaster Man]

There are plenty of conditions that you cannot see.

Just please remember. You cannot see all disabilities.

My cousin has diabetes and when we get the ADA pass we always get "the look" of accusing us that we are abusing the system. I totally understand you can not always physically see it.

[CoasterDemon]

^Exactly. A couple years ago, I got on Viper with a friend and a group of folks waiting on the other side were eyeing and talking about us. There were 3 or 4 adults, and a few kids; they were obviously together. They kept talking and looking, then got real quiet and looked at us. One of the kids looked at me and said "what's wrong with you?" I politely told him "some people have disabilities you can't see." I had the inkling they got the kid to ask me. People are people.

The real issue is that Six Flags employees (at the several SF parks I've been to in the years since 2011, my first time getting the ADA pass) often have poor communication with each other and you might be expected to explain to other guests that the seat they are getting is was reserved for you. This is very common. I don't explain this to the guest anymore, I politely tell the ride op that "someone got in my seat," and return to my waiting area. Happens all the time. Sometimes this happens twice in a row... I don't blame the ride ops necessarily, I blame SF for poor training. This has never been a problem at Cedar Point or Knotts (2 weeks ago). It's quite the contrast. Also, I worked at CP for 3 summers while in school in the 90s... and we had squeeky-tight operations with VERY healthy communication. Everyone on crew knew what was happening with the ride and inside the station at all times; it was a big part of training.

Those little mess-ups on SF crews are a high class issue in my eyes and doesn't affect me much. Unfortunately, it takes time and can hold up an entire operation - I'm talking stop the operation, make everyone wait longer because the crews were not shown how to communicate properly. There are always a few employees that know whats going on, and they try so hard. I don't blame the others, like I said it's a training issue, chain-wide. These type of situations, in my eyes, are what draw a lot of attention to the whole ADA debacle that SF has had. That is on top of what already are generally considered poor operations.

If the line isn't too long, it's usually easier for myself and friends to just wait. It's often not worth the stares and confusion (caused by Six Flags.)

[maxwellt]

When I went Monday, the first ride on Superman was about 40min. Then joker was an hour, xflight was about a half an hour, and eagle was about 40. We broke for lunch and then the rest of the day was 30 minutes or less. Raging bull wait was 20 max, with a front row wait too! Raging bull crew is the best! Goliath was also only a half an hour, which was really good for Goliath in my opinion. Operations are getting better, but Goliath could use some help, and xflight could be a tad faster

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[Ilovthevu']

Eagle & Superman at 40 min probably has to do with the 2 seat checkers that the park only has for those rides. They should have 4 seat checkers. I just looked at a video for X-Flight, and they have 5 employees in the station. 2 seat checkers per side + the person on top. You can blame the people that staff the rides for the 40 minute waits on Superman & Eagle.

You do say that Raging Bull is the best, but they also have an easier train to deal with. They only have a lap bar. No seat belts around waist (American Eagle / Viper / Goliath) or seat belts connecting to harnesses (Batman / X-Flight / Joker) / no worrying about leg restraints on Superman or if the restraint is securely locked on Superman (Superman has very sensitive restraints).

[Dan The Coaster Man]

Honestly I have always thought that Batman's line moves just as fast as RB's if not faster. That might just be me but I think it eats up people just as well. But I do understand the seat beat with the restraint.

[maxwellt]

I do understand that, I wish a ride like Goliath only had the lap bar too, that would be slick for that ride

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[Dan The Coaster Man]

I mean, wouldn't it be convenient if there were no seat belts at all?

[MrsTaxi]

I mean, wouldn't it be convenient if there were no seat belts at all?

Perhaps.....but becoming sidewalk pizza isn't. The Texas Giant accident is still too fresh.

[MrsTaxi]

^Exactly. A couple years ago, I got on Viper with a friend and a group of folks waiting on the other side were eyeing and talking about us. There were 3 or 4 adults, and a few kids; they were obviously together. They kept talking and looking, then got real quiet and looked at us. One of the kids looked at me and said "what's wrong with you?" I politely told him "some people have disabilities you can't see." I had the inkling they got the kid to ask me. People are people.

The real issue is that Six Flags employees (at the several SF parks I've been to in the years since 2011, my first time getting the ADA pass) often have poor communication with each other and you might be expected to explain to other guests that the seat they are getting is was reserved for you. This is very common. I don't explain this to the guest anymore, I politely tell the ride op that "someone got in my seat," and return to my waiting area. Happens all the time. Sometimes this happens twice in a row... I don't blame the ride ops necessarily, I blame SF for poor training. This has never been a problem at Cedar Point or Knotts (2 weeks ago). It's quite the contrast. Also, I worked at CP for 3 summers while in school in the 90s... and we had squeeky-tight operations with VERY healthy communication. Everyone on crew knew what was happening with the ride and inside the station at all times; it was a big part of training.

Those little mess-ups on SF crews are a high class issue in my eyes and doesn't affect me much. Unfortunately, it takes time and can hold up an entire operation - I'm talking stop the operation, make everyone wait longer because the crews were not shown how to communicate properly. There are always a few employees that know whats going on, and they try so hard. I don't blame the others, like I said it's a training issue, chain-wide. These type of situations, in my eyes, are what draw a lot of attention to the whole ADA debacle that SF has had. That is on top of what already are generally considered poor operations.

If the line isn't too long, it's usually easier for myself and friends to just wait. It's often not worth the stares and confusion (caused by Six Flags.)

You have hit the nail on the head. My husband uses the ada pass. (legit doctors note on file) He walks with a slight limp, but otherwise looks ok. Many times our seats get taken and the ride ops say NOTHING. Last year on AE the ride attendant actually ignored us....did not want to sign the sheet...arrange our ride.....nada. Supervisor noticed from the exit ramp what was going on. Watched that kid get ripped a new one.
Using an ADA pass shouldn't be embarrassing! Why are ride attendants pointing at us when telling the next person to wait one train? Geez.

[CoasterDemon]

^It's really a shame. I always remember that it is NOT the employees faults. It's a training issue that is part of the Six Flags fabric, and unique to the chain. There are our $70 season passes...

Another minor squabble is that you really have to push yourself up there to get noticed with the ADA pass. It's VERY "every man, woman and child for themselves." I'm lucky because I know how to take care of and speak up for myself (politely and kindly, of course), and know how to navigate in my best interest. I see people standing there sometimes who cannot speak (or speak very well) for themselves, and they are not going to get half-way decent care. It's shameful.

And those 1/3 mile long exit ramps... a couple years ago I helped a guy in a wheel chair get up the Raging Bull exit ramp. What a nightmare, and I wasn't even the one in the wheelchair! It took forever, people rushing and jumping over us and around us in those not-so-wide ramps. I couldn't even imagine doing that over at Eagle. Again, that is all built into the Six Flags fabric. That's how they do things, it's all corporate passive-aggressiveness. Make people walk, make them hungry and thirsty... make them want to pay for better service (Flash Pass)... bulk of seating is in restaurants. Again, there are our cheap season passes.

I wish Cedar Fair could/would purchase SF Great America, Magic Mountain and a few others... we might have to say goodbye to a few trees, but man those parks would operate like a dream! Of course, you have to pay for what you get and season passes would be 2 or 3 times the cost - but totally worth it.

At Cedar Point and the Busch parks, the ADA implementation couldn't be more user-friendly. Clear waiting areas for wheel chairs - or anyone who doesn't wanna have to play twister with a bunch of strangers. It's also very fast; they do not hold up the operation of their rides (which already have much higher capacity due to excellent operations).

Don't get me wrong, I'm very grateful for the privilege to get the pass, and DO love my home park. But going to some of these other parks and seeing how they're run... it's a completely different world.

[BCarroll]

Plus, I think it is nice that some attractions at Cedar Point have elevators for easy access for wheelchairs!

[CoasterDemon]

^Oh yes, I forgot to add that! Even many "little parks" have elevators.

I love how Busch Gardens designed several of their coaster stations. They seem to be someone level with the midway/walkway. The station exit opens up to a large area, so everyone doesn't have to "funnel" like sardines down some stupid exit ramp. It's all very user-friendly and ergonomic. And those exits are also designed to be close to the rest of the park. No half-mile walks back to the midway, that is almost exclusively a "Six Flags feature."

[Dan The Coaster Man]

Not really a rant, but along the same topic somewhat... Thinking of stopping by the park around 6 tonight, how are the lines looking so far today? I imagine not a lot of people are in HH today.

[Guy_With_A_Stick]

Dark Knight was using its outdoor queues.

If that doesn't say something, I don't know what does.

[maxwellt]

That makes me scared for tmrw....

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[Ilovthevu']

^Well, when it's colder out, that means that less people are going for all these water things like the waterpark + the other water rides, so thus everything else is much more packed. Seems familiar? Yep, the same thing happens in October. I would say to not go on a 70-79 degree day during the summer if you want shorter lines for the regular park. On the flip side, if 77 degrees being the high in Gurnee is your type of day at a waterpark / water rides, go tomorrow. Those lines can't be that bad. While everyone else is suffering in line for Batman (indoors), and hr wait, enjoy your more empty water park / water rides. People will still be on those water rides though. It's not like it's 72 degrees tomorrow but it's also not 85 degrees in Gurnee tomorrow.

They should get rid of Buccaneer Battle already. Add a pendulum, Chance Alpine Bobs, and a Chance Wipeout in that area instead. And all those rides can be open in November rather than Buccaneer Battle. Some might say roller coaster in that spot, but I don't think so. I think they are planning sooner than later to take out the black Arrow coaster across the way. They haven't filled in the spot next to that coaster for years already. No game / no food stand / no nothing, so I think they have major plans for another coaster to replace it. Who knows when they will pull the trigger though? They should go with a Tony Hawk coaster, but they probably won't.

[Foltzy]

Dark Knight was using its outdoor queues.

If that doesn't say something, I don't know what does.

Was it really that crowded. Friday it seemed almost deserted.

[Dan The Coaster Man]

Lines weren't that bad yesterday when I did end up going. Granted, it was around 7pm but the longest line I saw was superman probably only for 35-40 mins. Joker was about the same.