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2019 rumors, thoughts, speculation

Talk about anything that has to do with Six Flags Great America and Hurricane Harbor here.
Postby Sven18 on May 13th, 2018, 11:41 am
Goku1910 wrote:
It's unfortunate that I agree with your standpoint except the Hurricane Harbor part. We're not "due" for anything but it's pretty easy to see that Six Flags plans on cloning things to death.

This is why I said in the other thread that I'm liking Cedar Fair's strategy more than Six Flags currently. I would rather have more spread out additions if it meant they were better. The recent news that Six Flags wants to acquire more parks only worries me more since they have this obsession with every park getting something every year.

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SFGAM has not gotten WP stuff since when? I don't go to the WP, but I thing it might be 2011 or about that time. WP stuff has a great ROI and takes pressure off the dry side ride lines. I am betting heavily on 2019 WP addition and I don't think it takes up all the new space. Some of that space could be saved for future flat ride(s).

The we give every park something every year is something SF hypes. Yes, many of would prefer the off year model and get better rides. Would not be to concerned about the talk of buying new parks, they talked about that in several in conf calls. It's largely centered around Water parks near existing parks, like they did in Cali last year. SF while not releasing specific dollar amounts, say the new WP had record attendance and boosted revenue. SF from comments are looking for turn key additions, that don't require major investment. Also, there are not really many great dry park prospects in my opinion. The best might be Darien Lake, which SF sold. On the Q1 conf call this was more of if we see a great dry park deal, they will think about it. But, they were definitely acting seeking WP deals. They even seemed to be hinting of something coming soon.
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Postby Goku1910 on May 13th, 2018, 11:54 am
I seriously doubt it's a Waterpark expansion. Ours is already large compared to other Six Flags parks.

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Postby B&MGuy35 on May 13th, 2018, 11:56 am
Goku1910 wrote:I seriously doubt it's a Waterpark expansion. Ours is already large compared to other Six Flags parks.

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Let’s be honest with ourselves. It’s both!!
Raptor Clone and water park expansion!

Oh and they’re bringing back Lemon Chill too!


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Postby SFGAMNUT9302 on May 13th, 2018, 1:46 pm
The gimmick rides, such as Larson loops, are just space fillers! Fun experiences with a small price tag, that bring a buzz to the park year after year and have good returns on investment..... I liked Power Dive alot (Minus the painful restraints) and I'm glad we finally have a similar but less painful experience again.... When I look at Sky Trek Tower from ground level, I envision a large Dive Machine, T-Rex or B&M Floorless wrapping around that Tower and diving into that grassy area by the Carousel pool..... A highly photogenic steel beast at the front gates, that will get Great Americas name on every coaster website and TV show. While also dramatically driving up sales at Carousel Plaza Gifts and selling tons of on ride photos.... That's what I'm betting on. They won't let that space go to waste.
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Postby Sven18 on May 13th, 2018, 2:02 pm
SFGAMNUT9302 wrote:The gimmick rides, such as Larson loops, are just space fillers! Fun experiences with a small price tag, that bring a buzz to the park year after year and have good returns on investment..... I liked Power Dive alot (Minus the painful restraints) and I'm glad we finally have a similar but less painful experience again.... When I look at Sky Trek Tower from ground level, I envision a large Dive Machine, T-Rex or B&M Floorless wrapping around that Tower and diving into that grassy area by the Carousel pool..... A highly photogenic steel beast at the front gates, that will get Great Americas name on every coaster website and TV show. While also dramatically driving up sales at Carousel Plaza Gifts and selling tons of on ride photos.... That's what I'm betting on. They won't let that space go to waste.


Gimmick rides is what SF is mainly about post bankruptcy..9 superloops and 6 S&S free flys. The notion SF can buy a dive coaster or any big/expensive ground up coaster is based on pure fantasy about their finances and corporate strategy. SF keeps telling people what the are doing in conf calls and people ignore it. They have no intention on spending big, they are actually talking about backing off the 9% cap exp and lower it, not increase it. SF thinks they can get all they want spending about 74M/yr on rides. They can't buy big coasters on 74M/yr and giving every park something. There is a reason they have been buying cheap coasters since bankruptcy, they are constrained by their cap exp formula. The chain is run by finance and wall street people. Anderson had no experience in the industry and thus did everything by the numbers and embarked on financial restraint which has been great for share holders and made him very rich(still holding almost 250M in shares) with all the share options he got as compensation.
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Postby SFGAM_Hog on May 13th, 2018, 2:09 pm
I hope they don't waste it. If it were a raptor or a T-Rex the lift and turn around into the drop could fill in the land by hometown fun machine, and the ride would utilize the Pictorium's area.
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Postby SFGAMNUT9302 on May 13th, 2018, 2:18 pm
Sven18 wrote:
SFGAMNUT9302 wrote:The gimmick rides, such as Larson loops, are just space fillers! Fun experiences with a small price tag, that bring a buzz to the park year after year and have good returns on investment..... I liked Power Dive alot (Minus the painful restraints) and I'm glad we finally have a similar but less painful experience again.... When I look at Sky Trek Tower from ground level, I envision a large Dive Machine, T-Rex or B&M Floorless wrapping around that Tower and diving into that grassy area by the Carousel pool..... A highly photogenic steel beast at the front gates, that will get Great Americas name on every coaster website and TV show. While also dramatically driving up sales at Carousel Plaza Gifts and selling tons of on ride photos.... That's what I'm betting on. They won't let that space go to waste.


Gimmick rides is what SF is mainly about post bankruptcy..9 superloops and 6 S&S free flys. The notion SF can buy a dive coaster or any big/expensive ground up coaster is based on pure fantasy about their finances and corporate strategy. SF keeps telling people what the are doing in conf calls and people ignore it. They have no intention on spending big, they are actually talking about backing off the 9% cap exp and lower it, not increase it. SF thinks they can get all they want spending about 74M/yr on rides. They can't buy big coasters on 74M/yr and giving every park something. There is a reason they have been buying cheap coasters since bankruptcy, they are constrained by their cap exp formula. The chain is run by finance and wall street people. Anderson had no experience in the industry and thus did everything by the numbers and embarked on financial restraint which has been great for share holders and made him very rich(still holding almost 250M in shares) with all the share options he got as compensation.


We got X-Flight and Goliath when they could have easily strapped their budget and installed a Sky Screamer or a Chance Chaos..... This goes back to that apples and oranges parks analogy, Great America isn't like Six Flags St Louis or Six Flags America, it draws substantially larger crowds, and is one of the most profitable parks, if not the most profitable park in the chain. That's why they invest so heavily into this park and add major additions, while smaller parks get relocated Boomerangs and lazy rivers expansions. A $25 Million coaster for one park in the chain, while adding Skywraps, Giant Discoveries and Tilt a whirls to all the other parks, would in no way break their cap formula.
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Postby B&MGuy35 on May 13th, 2018, 2:44 pm
SFGAMNUT9302 wrote:
Sven18 wrote:
SFGAMNUT9302 wrote:The gimmick rides, such as Larson loops, are just space fillers! Fun experiences with a small price tag, that bring a buzz to the park year after year and have good returns on investment..... I liked Power Dive alot (Minus the painful restraints) and I'm glad we finally have a similar but less painful experience again.... When I look at Sky Trek Tower from ground level, I envision a large Dive Machine, T-Rex or B&M Floorless wrapping around that Tower and diving into that grassy area by the Carousel pool..... A highly photogenic steel beast at the front gates, that will get Great Americas name on every coaster website and TV show. While also dramatically driving up sales at Carousel Plaza Gifts and selling tons of on ride photos.... That's what I'm betting on. They won't let that space go to waste.


Gimmick rides is what SF is mainly about post bankruptcy..9 superloops and 6 S&S free flys. The notion SF can buy a dive coaster or any big/expensive ground up coaster is based on pure fantasy about their finances and corporate strategy. SF keeps telling people what the are doing in conf calls and people ignore it. They have no intention on spending big, they are actually talking about backing off the 9% cap exp and lower it, not increase it. SF thinks they can get all they want spending about 74M/yr on rides. They can't buy big coasters on 74M/yr and giving every park something. There is a reason they have been buying cheap coasters since bankruptcy, they are constrained by their cap exp formula. The chain is run by finance and wall street people. Anderson had no experience in the industry and thus did everything by the numbers and embarked on financial restraint which has been great for share holders and made him very rich(still holding almost 250M in shares) with all the share options he got as compensation.


We got X-Flight and Goliath when they could have easily strapped their budget and installed a Sky Screamer or a Chance Chaos..... This goes back to that apples and oranges parks analogy, Great America isn't like Six Flags St Louis or Six Flags America, it draws substantially larger crowds, and is one of the most profitable parks, if not the most profitable park in the chain. That's why they invest so heavily into this park and add major additions, while smaller parks get relocated Boomerangs and lazy rivers expansions. A $25 Million coaster for one park in the chain, while adding Skywraps, Giant Discoveries and Tilt a whirls to all the other parks, would in no way break their cap formula.


I agree with you 100%!
This park has always been different from any other park in the chain and hopefully that will continue with the 2019 addition!


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Postby Sven18 on May 13th, 2018, 2:46 pm
SFGAMNUT9302 wrote:
Sven18 wrote:
SFGAMNUT9302 wrote:The gimmick rides, such as Larson loops, are just space fillers! Fun experiences with a small price tag, that bring a buzz to the park year after year and have good returns on investment..... I liked Power Dive alot (Minus the painful restraints) and I'm glad we finally have a similar but less painful experience again.... When I look at Sky Trek Tower from ground level, I envision a large Dive Machine, T-Rex or B&M Floorless wrapping around that Tower and diving into that grassy area by the Carousel pool..... A highly photogenic steel beast at the front gates, that will get Great Americas name on every coaster website and TV show. While also dramatically driving up sales at Carousel Plaza Gifts and selling tons of on ride photos.... That's what I'm betting on. They won't let that space go to waste.


Gimmick rides is what SF is mainly about post bankruptcy..9 superloops and 6 S&S free flys. The notion SF can buy a dive coaster or any big/expensive ground up coaster is based on pure fantasy about their finances and corporate strategy. SF keeps telling people what the are doing in conf calls and people ignore it. They have no intention on spending big, they are actually talking about backing off the 9% cap exp and lower it, not increase it. SF thinks they can get all they want spending about 74M/yr on rides. They can't buy big coasters on 74M/yr and giving every park something. There is a reason they have been buying cheap coasters since bankruptcy, they are constrained by their cap exp formula. The chain is run by finance and wall street people. Anderson had no experience in the industry and thus did everything by the numbers and embarked on financial restraint which has been great for share holders and made him very rich(still holding almost 250M in shares) with all the share options he got as compensation.


We got X-Flight and Goliath when they could have easily strapped their budget and installed a Sky Screamer or a Chance Chaos..... This goes back to that apples and oranges parks analogy, Great America isn't like Six Flags St Louis or Six Flags America, it draws substantially larger crowds, and is one of the most profitable parks, if not the most profitable park in the chain. That's why they invest so heavily into this park and add major additions, while smaller parks get relocated Boomerangs and lazy rivers expansions. A $25 Million coaster for one park in the chain, while adding Skywraps, Giant Discoveries and Tilt a whirls to all the other parks, would in no way break their cap formula.


You're in enthusiast fantasy land. Xflight is the cheapest B&M wing by a lot and Golaith is the cheapest ground up RMC made by a lot. Both were under 14M. The notion SF is spending 25M on one park is not how they run things and have not done anything close since bankruptcy. You're thinking about the SF pre bankruptcy that thought nothing of $25M coasters. Listen to their conf calls and investor presentations. Even think logically besides their financial formula restraints. Why would they spend big when people keep showing up for scant investments of 7M free flys, 1M superloops, 10M RMC conversions, etc...? SF is getting good ROI on cheap investments and there is no proof spending 3 times as much will produce 3X ROI. SF got in trouble with the big spend logic w/o it producing the ROI. SF can say they are happy with their gross cap exp for rides of 74M b/c they have cultivated a base of people that want cheap prices over big coasters. If people want big expensive coasters then SF is the wrong chain to be a patron. It's interesting how SF keeps making their strategy clear and say it. Meanwhile people live in their alternate reality ignoring SF's clear strategy, $25M coasters aren't coming to any SF park.
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Postby AirTimeDaz on May 13th, 2018, 2:58 pm
In some of the WW-GLC interviews today, Alan Schilke seems to be hinting at larger raptors and/or T-rex on the near horizon.

:wink:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LN_Q6l6sjKY
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Postby SFGAMNUT9302 on May 13th, 2018, 2:59 pm
Do you not understand the difference between a large park that gets 3 million guests and a small park that barely gets 1 Million guests? You don't seem to take that into account at all, and seem to think that Santas Village is somehow comparable to Great America. Premier screwed everything up, not because they purchased large rides, but because they purchased far too many of them on credit, and they were trying to turn road side carnivals into mega parks by adding hypers to parks that barely crack 600,000 guests per year. You just said getting a large coaster was "Pure fantasy post bankruptcy" I pointed out that we've gotten two of them post bankruptcy, and now you're saying they're "Cheap" lol. It's simple math, if you don't install 3 free spins and 3 Justice leagues in one season (Total price tag of $51 Million) and install one $25 Million coaster, and 5 Sky Wraps ($2 Million each) You would reduce your expense budget by $16 Million, stay well within the cap. As far as major attractions go, it's an amusement park right in between Chicago and Milwaukee! Their slogan is "Go Big" for God sake.... Just look at the target audience at Great America. It's almost entirely young people with expendable cash, not a bunch of old ladies.
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Postby Sven18 on May 13th, 2018, 3:35 pm
SFGAMNUT9302 wrote:Do you not understand the difference between a large park that gets 3 million guests and a small park that barely gets 1 Million guests? You don't seem to take that into account at all, and seem to think that Santas Village is somehow comparable to Great America. Premier screwed everything up, not because they purchased large rides, but because they purchased far too many of them on credit, and they were trying to turn road side carnivals into mega parks by adding hypers to parks that barely crack 600,000 guests per year. You just said getting a large coaster was "Pure fantasy post bankruptcy" I pointed out that we've gotten two of them post bankruptcy, and now you're saying they're "Cheap" lol. It's simple math, if you don't install 3 free spins and 3 Justice leagues in one season (Total price tag of $51 Million) and install one $25 Million coaster, and 5 Sky Wraps ($2 Million each) You would reduce your expense budget by $16 Million, stay well within the cap. As far as major attractions go, it's an amusement park right in between Chicago and Milwaukee! Their slogan is "Go Big" for God sake.... Just look at the target audience at Great America. It's almost entirely young people with expendable cash, not a bunch of old ladies.


LOL..I perfectly understand you're an enthusiast living in a fantasy land. SF does not care about your fanatsy and the Santa's Village stuff is pure nonsensical illusion to gather that from my posts. SF gives 3M+ visitor parks 4D's, superloops, etc... The fact you think the smallest cheapest B&M and the smallest cheapest RMC topper track are big coasters, shows the patron base that SF has masterfully cultivated. They love that you think this way and it's how they can keep putting in cheap small stuff and you will always buy a season pass. it;s their high volume/low cost model working perfectly. You think sub 14M coasters and really short ones are "Big". LOL! SF does not think in lines with your fantasy. They have not and do not spend 25M on one park, it's against their strategy, which has been golden of giving a bunch of inexpensive rides to parks that guarantee an adequate ROI There is no point to spend big when people show up no matter what and think sub 14M coasters are "Big". Again, why would any corporation that has cultivated a base like you, spend 25M on big coaster not going to produce a 3X ROI to the ROI of 7M coaster. You show up for 7M free flys and people were giddy for it? SF knows this and thus knows they can spend on inexpensive Raptors, 4D's, Skywarps, superloops, etc... SF does not work with big rides every few years and off years, they give cheap stuff to all but the Escapes, SFA. LR, every year. They brag about how everybody gets a ride yearly, no matter how crappy.
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Postby Goku1910 on May 13th, 2018, 3:40 pm
Although both of you have points, an argument filled with acronyms and "LOL's" used as a euphemism is also one that doesn't seem credible.

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Postby SFGAMNUT9302 on May 13th, 2018, 3:54 pm
Sven18 wrote:
SFGAMNUT9302 wrote:Do you not understand the difference between a large park that gets 3 million guests and a small park that barely gets 1 Million guests? You don't seem to take that into account at all, and seem to think that Santas Village is somehow comparable to Great America. Premier screwed everything up, not because they purchased large rides, but because they purchased far too many of them on credit, and they were trying to turn road side carnivals into mega parks by adding hypers to parks that barely crack 600,000 guests per year. You just said getting a large coaster was "Pure fantasy post bankruptcy" I pointed out that we've gotten two of them post bankruptcy, and now you're saying they're "Cheap" lol. It's simple math, if you don't install 3 free spins and 3 Justice leagues in one season (Total price tag of $51 Million) and install one $25 Million coaster, and 5 Sky Wraps ($2 Million each) You would reduce your expense budget by $16 Million, stay well within the cap. As far as major attractions go, it's an amusement park right in between Chicago and Milwaukee! Their slogan is "Go Big" for God sake.... Just look at the target audience at Great America. It's almost entirely young people with expendable cash, not a bunch of old ladies.


LOL..SF does not care and the Santa's Village stuff is pure nonsensical. They give 3M+ visitor parks 4D's, superloops, etc... The fact you think the smallest cheapest B&M and the smallest cheapest RMC topper track are big coasters, shows the patron base that SF has masterfully cultivated. They love that you think this way and it's how they can keep putting in cheap small stuff and you will always buy the cheap season pass. You think sub 14M coasters and really short ones are "Big". LOL! SF does not think in lines with your fantasy. They have not and do not spend 25M on one park, it's against their strategy which has been golden of giving a bunch of inexpensive rides to parks that guarantee an adequate ROI There is no point to spend big when people show up no matter what and think sub 14M coasters are "Big". Again, why would any corporation that has cultivated a base like you, spend 25M on big coaster when you show up for 7M free flys and people were giddy for it? SF knows this and thus knows they can spend on inexpensive Raptors, 4D's, Skywarps, superloops, etc... SF does not work with big rides every few years and off years, they give cheap stuff to all but the Escapes, SFA. LR, every year. They brag about how everybody gets a ride yearly, no matter how crappy.


It's nonsensical to you, because your brain can't seem to understand that a major park with 3 Million + guests a year is nowhere near comparable to a small park that get's a fraction of that, and that capital is added accordingly. Corporate will obviously invest heavily into a park with higher attendance, a larger base and a larger profit. Seeing as that size comparison and basic math doesn't register with you, it's no wonder that you think a $7 Million free spin and a $15 Million wing coaster are both "gimmicks" or even remotely comparable, when one is almost double the price. As far as Goliath and X-Flight being small, yeah it's called open real estate, you can't exactly cram something like Texas Giant into Iron Wolfs old plot of land. Just look at Cedar Fairs strategy, they seem to be doing very well right now, and they're adding capital accordingly. Smaller parks get almost nothing, while the larger and more profitable parks get large attractions. Do you seriously think Magic Mountain is going to add a Raptor or a Freespin for it's 20th coaster? lol. You fail to realize that the cap expenditure formula in no way rules out larger rides, and seem to think you saying "It just aint going to happen" somehow makes it valid, lol.
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Postby astucks18 on May 13th, 2018, 6:43 pm
Sven18 wrote:
_FuryBull_330_ wrote:
SFGAM_Hog wrote:[quote="Sven18"] SF is going to clone Raptors b/c they are inexpensive and they don't care about capacity, they put 4D's in parks with 3M+ visitors.

I do not think capacity is a big issue with Joker at our park at least. When it first opened the line moved at a good pace, and still does now. 4Ds in parks like ours isn't a big problem. Parks clone rides so guests nationwide and worldwide (Disney) can experience the same thrill. I'm glad we got the Joker and Justice League, etc. So I wouldn't have to travel to Great Adventure or St. Louis.

Based on how Fiesta Texas' raptor system is going, it seems like a fine system (as long as they run 4 trains).


They can have 4,5,6 trains, the thing is limited by blocking and dispatch times. If by luck and hustle, something SF is not known for you, have 45sec dispatches, it only gets you 600pph. That's poor for a coaster at any substantial sized park.[/quote]Raptors do not have enough block sections to run more than 3 or 4 max

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Postby Sven18 on May 13th, 2018, 6:53 pm
SFGAMNUT9302 wrote:
Sven18 wrote:
SFGAMNUT9302 wrote:Do you not understand the difference between a large park that gets 3 million guests and a small park that barely gets 1 Million guests? You don't seem to take that into account at all, and seem to think that Santas Village is somehow comparable to Great America. Premier screwed everything up, not because they purchased large rides, but because they purchased far too many of them on credit, and they were trying to turn road side carnivals into mega parks by adding hypers to parks that barely crack 600,000 guests per year. You just said getting a large coaster was "Pure fantasy post bankruptcy" I pointed out that we've gotten two of them post bankruptcy, and now you're saying they're "Cheap" lol. It's simple math, if you don't install 3 free spins and 3 Justice leagues in one season (Total price tag of $51 Million) and install one $25 Million coaster, and 5 Sky Wraps ($2 Million each) You would reduce your expense budget by $16 Million, stay well within the cap. As far as major attractions go, it's an amusement park right in between Chicago and Milwaukee! Their slogan is "Go Big" for God sake.... Just look at the target audience at Great America. It's almost entirely young people with expendable cash, not a bunch of old ladies.


LOL..SF does not care and the Santa's Village stuff is pure nonsensical. They give 3M+ visitor parks 4D's, superloops, etc... The fact you think the smallest cheapest B&M and the smallest cheapest RMC topper track are big coasters, shows the patron base that SF has masterfully cultivated. They love that you think this way and it's how they can keep putting in cheap small stuff and you will always buy the cheap season pass. You think sub 14M coasters and really short ones are "Big". LOL! SF does not think in lines with your fantasy. They have not and do not spend 25M on one park, it's against their strategy which has been golden of giving a bunch of inexpensive rides to parks that guarantee an adequate ROI There is no point to spend big when people show up no matter what and think sub 14M coasters are "Big". Again, why would any corporation that has cultivated a base like you, spend 25M on big coaster when you show up for 7M free flys and people were giddy for it? SF knows this and thus knows they can spend on inexpensive Raptors, 4D's, Skywarps, superloops, etc... SF does not work with big rides every few years and off years, they give cheap stuff to all but the Escapes, SFA. LR, every year. They brag about how everybody gets a ride yearly, no matter how crappy.


It's nonsensical to you, because your brain can't seem to understand that a major park with 3 Million + guests a year is nowhere near comparable to a small park that get's a fraction of that, and that capital is added accordingly. Corporate will obviously invest heavily into a park with higher attendance, a larger base and a larger profit. Seeing as that size comparison and basic math doesn't register with you, it's no wonder that you think a $7 Million free spin and a $15 Million wing coaster are both "gimmicks" or even remotely comparable, when one is almost double the price. As far as Goliath and X-Flight being small, yeah it's called open real estate, you can't exactly cram something like Texas Giant into Iron Wolfs old plot of land. Just look at Cedar Fairs strategy, they seem to be doing very well right now, and they're adding capital accordingly. Smaller parks get almost nothing, while the larger and more profitable parks get large attractions. Do you seriously think Magic Mountain is going to add a Raptor or a Freespin for it's 20th coaster? lol. You fail to realize that the cap expenditure formula in no way rules out larger rides, and seem to think you saying "It just aint going to happen" somehow makes it valid, lol.


It's nonsensical b/c you're using enthusiast logic ignoring what SF does, says, and their clear and obvious strategy. They keep reiterating things in investor presentations and conf call which you clearly never bother with as it would crush your enthusiast based dreams.

SF has not been buying expensive coasters for any park, it's against their basis of their cap exp formula. Again they have no need to b/c people like you are going to buy passes anyway. Btw, don't pretend I said a wing coaster is a gimmick, 4D's are and that was what was said. X-wing is however the cheapest B&M wing and yes they could have made it bigger, but they are cheap. Golaith could have been bigger, but again they are cheap. They are cheap b/c they have a strict cap expenditure formula.

It's hilarious for you to try to use CF strategy to bolster your SF enthusiast logic, the strategies of the chain are inherently different. SF has a low cost/high volume model, CF is higher cost premium experience/lower volume..ie..CF has the same revenue with 6M less visitors annually. CF will buy big coasters for parks with the revenue, ebidta to support it. SF hasn't and won't since bankruptcy b/c they don't need to.

None of the coasters added to MM post bankruptcy have been high cost. The notion SF would not give an inexpensive coaster to SFMM is again enthusiast logic, not SF logic based on being run by Wall Street guys. The chain is not run by theme park industry people like CF. MM won't get a 4D b/c they already have a crappy Intamin Zacspin and yes they could get a Raptor. SF does not care about the capacity, Raptors are inexpensive and a single rail would be unique to SoCal. Long lines from low capacity are of no concern..ie... Full Throttle has poor capacity, as well as the Zacspin, which are 2 of the last 3 coasters they added to MM. Low cost is the main basis of their decision making process as it's to meet ROI goals. Again, b/c they have developed a patron base like you that will show up even for small investments. They aren't going to spend way more under your enthusiast logic. The cap exp formula has ruled out big coasters, I know it's impossible to get thru your head, but they haven't built a big cost coaster since bankruptcy. The reason is they can't! Yes, only a well cultivated SF patron they love like you, thinks Goliath or Xflight are big coasters in cost, they aren't both are sub 14M coasters.
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Postby Guy_With_A_Stick on May 13th, 2018, 7:12 pm
Are we really arguing over this? Six Flags has a set business strategy that they know works, so they're going to stick with it. There's most likely aspects of their strategy that we don't know about. So stop talking like you know how Six Flags runs their business. You're not an executive. If you really were, you'd be: a) posting with published facts and reports to back up your claim, and b) breaking some sort of NDA about this kind of thing.

The park is clearing space for something in 2019. That's all we know. It could very well be a water park expansion or a new coaster. We can't know until it's announced.
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Guy_With_A_Stick

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Postby Sven18 on May 13th, 2018, 7:45 pm
Guy_With_A_Stick wrote:Are we really arguing over this? Six Flags has a set business strategy that they know works, so they're going to stick with it.


That strategy is a hard capital exp formula of 9% North Ameican revenue(60%rides/25% asset mgmt/15% in park). The 9% is a max they are going to decrease. Returning every excess dollar to share holders in dividends and stock by backs. They have several recognized areas of growth opportunity..foreign deals; increases dining pass penetration; increase new passholders and memebers; conversion of old pass holders to memberships; and non summer season events(fright fest/holiday in the park) and possible future early spring events(MM going 365).


Guy_With_A_Stick wrote: a) posting with published facts and reports to back up your claim, and b) breaking some sort of NDA about this kind of thing.


Talking of published facts and reports violates nothing You might want to read their annual reports, quarterly earnings reports, listen to conf calls, see investor presentations, see investor presentation and investor Q&A. SF makes it clear of their strategy, the are coy on certain aspects of execution, but not the goals. SF has zero intention of big investments, they are looking to cut the % of investments over time, they like the current gross cap exp ride number of around 75M. They have no need to increase it. People show up for low cost investments and the large number of knew low cost coasters being made by manufacturers eliminates the need for buying high cost B&M's, Intamin's, etc,,,like in the 90's and 2000's The big easy obtained cash cow growth in revenue is going to be the foreign deals. No required investment and just collecting fees which ramp up. Look for 10 more foreign parks minimum in the next 5 years beyond the parks already announced. China is going to get a bunch of more parks beyond the known deals.
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Postby SFGAM_Hog on May 13th, 2018, 9:25 pm
^ You are acting like a child. You don't need to defend yourself anytime some says something that you don't like. Back on topic, please!
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Postby anewman35 on May 13th, 2018, 9:43 pm
Business strategies can change. I'm not saying this business strategy WILL change anytime soon, it probably won't. But it's just silly for anybody to act like they 100% know for sure what Six Flags will and won't do based on their past behavior.
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Postby Sven18 on May 13th, 2018, 9:58 pm
SFGAM_Hog wrote:^ You are acting like a child. You don't need to defend yourself anytime some says something that you don't like. Back on topic, please!


The children are those spouting fanboy and enthusiast delusions of 25M coasters. I'm stating the reality of what SF has clearly laid out. You people are the ones that don't like what is being said, though it's just what SF keeps reiterating in their annual/quarterly reports, conf calls, investor presentations and investor Q&A's.
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Postby Goku1910 on May 13th, 2018, 10:01 pm
Sven18 wrote:
SFGAM_Hog wrote:^ You are acting like a child. You don't need to defend yourself anytime some says something that you don't like. Back on topic, please!


The children are those spouting fanboy and enthusiast delusions of 25M coasters. I'm stating the reality of what SF has clearly laid out. You people are the ones that don't like what is being said, though it's just what SF keeps reiterating in their annual/quarterly reports, conf calls, investor presentations and investor Q&A's.


You got any quotes from these annual/quarterly reports, conf calls, investor presentations and investor Q&A's you keep mentioning over an over?

You can say you've read them all you want but that's meaningless to the people here. We're here to speculate and that is all, interpret it how you please.

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Postby SFGAM_Hog on May 13th, 2018, 10:02 pm
^ No, I simply just want to get back on topic. If you don't have anything to say about speculation, predictions, or anything involving 2019 attraction/addition please don't say it here.
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Postby Sven18 on May 13th, 2018, 10:21 pm
Goku1910 wrote:
Sven18 wrote:
SFGAM_Hog wrote:^ You are acting like a child. You don't need to defend yourself anytime some says something that you don't like. Back on topic, please!


The children are those spouting fanboy and enthusiast delusions of 25M coasters. I'm stating the reality of what SF has clearly laid out. You people are the ones that don't like what is being said, though it's just what SF keeps reiterating in their annual/quarterly reports, conf calls, investor presentations and investor Q&A's.


You got any quotes from these a you keep mentioning over an over?

You can say you've read them all you want but that's meaningless to the people here. We're here to speculate and that is all, interpret it how you please.

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Everything I said is from the annual/quarterly reports, conf calls, investor presentations and investor Q&A's.ie... The cap exp formula break down by components, the 4 growth areas stated, why they are pushing memberships or passes and want to convert pass holders, foreign park strategy, (which btw is not going to help cap exp state side b/c it's not included in revenue for cap exp), etc....etc...

There is a difference between speculation and engaging in fantasies.
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Postby JaminOut on May 13th, 2018, 10:56 pm
Can we get the admins to block BBD’s fourth iteration on this site yet? I had my doubts about Sven18, but now I’m certain it’s “Mr. LOL, pearl clutched, we are getting a super loop for 2017 bc I have inside sources, no YOU’RE stupid”...

For those of you new(er) to the forum, two summers ago there was a user who plagued this site with negative energy. A bunch of us came together and we able to have the admins give him the boot. Unfortunately, he found ways to keep coming back attempting to keep his mannerisms from giving away his identity; he failed in his attempts more than once.

Please don’t respond to this child, you are just giving them what they want. The admins will take care of the situation sooner or later.

Back on topic (as I have yet to pitch in), this plot of land does not appear to be of similar layout to that of the two Raptors currently erected so if we were to get a Raptor, I think it would be custom; I also don’t think the space is large enough for a T-Rex. A water park expansion seems like a possibility, but this is prime real estate for the dry park... especially when HH can expand into the parking lot. Whatever it ends up being, it certainly feels like it will be a coaster.


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