Seatbelt Question

[[jonrev]]

What ever happened to the Shockwave control panel?

2 words: Scrap yard.

[Binks Drake]

It's now in a museum of old rides no one cares about anymore...

I thought that covered that well...

[twixmix0303]

There is Gemini's 3 wonderful blocks, and yes we can do 3 train operation as it is right now, just add the 3rd train and it'll go. Arrow Dynamic's design of its rides doesn't seem to make sense unless you operate it, then you'd really understand.

So can you set each brake individually without being switched over to maintenance? That's somewhat interesting but does make sense.

[RagingBullFan]

There is no "individual" brake controls, we can only control sets of brakes. There also is no maintenance mode. Its either On or Off. We have manual control of station brakes, trim/safety brakes (Either Open/Set), and then the trim brakes had settings of 0-6 with 0 being both sets of trim brakes are open, 1 adding about 20 PSI pressure to the tanks for both sets of brakes ( C-Brake and Spiral Entrance) each number from there adds about 5 PSI to the C-Brakes, the spiral entrance is a constant 20 PSI.

[Shockwavegirl]

You can have as many trains as there are blocks, so long as there is a holding point in each block. Therefore, if a train stops in it's particular block, than all subsequent trains will stop in it's block. For example,on Shockwave if a trouble light is indicated, the lift will stop, stopping any trains from entering the block already occupied, the mid-course brake run, will stop any train from entering the next block, and the end-course brake run, will stop the third. So tell me where in that scenario, do you need the so called 4th block? All trains are now stopped, in their respective blocks, with no collisions.

[twixmix0303]

The idea is that the station and two sets of brakes behind the station are the fourth, fifth, and sixth blocks. If the end of the brake run is the end of the third block, and the next block is the lift, then how does the train in the brake run advance to the lift if the lift is occupied? I see exactly what you are saying, that the brake run and station do not count as blocks so therefore there are only 3 blocks, but in reality there are 6 different places where the train can be stopped, thus some people argue there are 6 blocks even though there are only 3. I guess it all depends on how you look at it. I am not disagreeing with you since the official manual states there are three blocks, I am only stating there are more than 3 places where the train can stop and am trying to clarify this for everyone else.

[FParker185]

I did say it was floating block, at least that's how the former head of SFGAm's electrictal department described it.

[Shockwavegirl]

Well, I can compromise in saying that there is more than one place that a train can stop on a ride, in fact there were 6 holding places in Shockwave's ride area itself, the lift, the mid course brake run, and the end brake run, which holds 3 trains, plus the station itself. But, blocks refer to the areas of the ride, where the train is in motion, therefore a serious collision could occur. Since the train really isn't in motion in the station, or in the end course brake run....they are not blocks. At least from an operators point of view. We were not allowed to send a train until the preceding train had completely left the block it was in. We rarely paid any attention to any trains coming into the brake run at the end, because if we timed the departure of the trains correctly, as we sent the 3rd train, the first would just about be finishing their ride. This just about kept a constant rotation of trains, so we were just about always filling and sending trains, this kept the line moving, instead of standing still. But, we didn't, (and the computer would let us)send a train until another left the block.......end brake run and station didn't count, since they aren't technically part of the ride area, because they come to a complete stop in those areas.

[twixmix0303]

It's an I say potato, you say pototo kind of thing here. Some people argue that each brake in the brake run counts as a block since it follows the same rules as the regular blocks (only one train in a time and it will not advance out unless the block ahead is clear) whereas maintenance/operations do not consider them to be blocks because they aren't really part of the ride. However everyone sees it, we can all agree that the ride could safely be run. And that is all that matters.

[Shockwavegirl]

They can argue....but they would be wrong. From what I learned running Shockwave, a brake run is a brake run....a block is a part of the ride, where trains going at speeds of up to 70 miles an hour could crash, if left to go at the same time in the same area(which is the BLOCK). Anyways, the only brake run called anything close to a block was the mid course brake run, which was called the block brakes, just because it separated 2 blocks from eachother.
This potato pototo thing, is only people who don't really know what they are talking about, trying to sound like they do, and not wanting to admit they are WRONG!

[RagingBullFan]

Well it also depends on the manufacturer's definiton.

According to Arrow Dynamics, your definition of a block is correct, where Trains are in motion and could collide ( At high speed).

According to Dinn & Summers on Mean Streak ( Allen-Bradley Control System) a block includes the individual brake runs. On Mean Streak there is Station-Transfer-Lift-Safety 1's-Safety 2's-Ready-Station

Safety 1 is the MCBR with Saftey 2's usually slowing the train to a reasonable speed ( Stopping in the event of a 3 train stack) and the Ready's either further slowing the train for entry into the station or holding the train until the station block is cleared.

[twixmix0303]

This potato pototo thing, is only people who don't really know what they are talking about, trying to sound like they do, and not wanting to admit they are WRONG!

Uhh, yeah, I said I agree with you, so please don't tell me I'm wrong unless you are, too. Obviously, you are having trouble reading full posts before putting in your two cents, too.

[Shockwavegirl]

Well, this whole argument started when someone told me that I was wrong that Shockwave had to have 4 blocks, and I told him that he was wrong.....and 15 posts or so later, here we are, still debating whether or not I was right in the first place. I hate being told I'm wrong, especially when I know I'm right. So since you were not the first one to tell me specifically I was wrong, it wasn't really directed at you in the first place, you only irritated an already painful sore. So I do apologize if it seemed my comment was directed towards you, when in fact, you are only one in a group of folks, who never worked on the ride(to my knowledge), who was telling me what I learned while training for it, was wrong.

[twixmix0303]

I was not one in that group of folks that was telling you that you are wrong. I was only clarifying what the other side of this arguement was trying to say. Each side is using a different definition for block and I am only stating the facts. I am on neither side.

[Shockwavegirl]

Just call you Switzerland right. OK, but we can't both be right. In the land of Arrow Dynamics coasters, I was right and they were wrong so I can sing the I was right song! As far as other coasters go, I don't know, I only ever worked on Arrow Dynamics...specifically Shockwave.

[twixmix0303]

I cannot believe how rude you are being right now. Like I said, I am neutral in all this but if you ask people with a half-decent knowledge of coasters and understands how a basic block system works (in fact I'd be happy to ask for you at NoCoasterCon) how many blocks at minimum are needed to run a coaster with 3 trains, 99% of them will say 4. If you had not already said there are 3 blocks, I would have said there are 4 as well. Face it, this is going nowhere, I tried to clarify so that maybe everyone would be satisfied, but obviously you are not. I suggest that this topic be locked as we will never get an answer that everyone can agree on.

[mschulz5]

Twix, If I were you I'd settle down a little bit. It seems like in every other thread you are involved in an argument these days. Just relax a little bit, or maybe take a break from the forums or something like that. I know you will say it's not your fault, but jeez, something's gotta be your fault if you are involved in every single tiff that goes on around here.

Just lighten up a little bit.

[twixmix0303]

Actually, I'm only involved in two arguements, and in one of them, I could really care less about what happens (this one). I don't think that stating facts or voicing your opinion is a wrongdoing. How about if you don't like an arugement, you just stay out of it rather than trying to be a mediator?

[kahmooza]

Now you're arguing about arguing

Where's the love?

[twixmix0303]

That is because I am the hated Fright Fest killing machine.

[Rusty888]

you must be up there with the boy who killed Christmas

But seriously, this has nothing to do with the title (seatbelt question) so let's just end it now!

[twixmix0303]

EDIT: I meant to quote but I accidentally hit "edit" instead. Anyways, it said something like:

Hehe, I actually tried to do that. We could open a poll and settle this once and for all...

[Shockwavegirl]

So what Twix, can't handle a little debate, we gotta lock the topic? No body is name calling or anything, just a little disagrement. Besides who elected you the official neutral mediator of the debate anyway, if you don't disagree with anyone, you don't need to fuel the debate further by putting your 2 cents in. In fact, this disagrement wouldn've probably died down on it's own without your help, in fact most people that started telling me I was wrong in the first place have stopped disagreeing with me, at least in the topic anyway. Who asked you to be their champion....I think we are all old enough to take care of ourselves.

Rude, apparently it's my middle name today.

[twixmix0303]

You are a f****** idiot! I WAS NEVER AGAINST YOU! PLEASE, GET THIS THROUGH YOUR HEAD! And then you said I was one in a group of folks that thinks you're wrong. Just admit it, you know that's a blatant lie. No name calling, eh? What about Switzerland? And let's see, that would be YOU dishing out the names. Here you are complaining that I am keeping this up, but then take a 180 and complain that it shouldn't be locked. I never called myself official mediator, so I don't know why you think that. I have no problem putting in my two cents. And trust me, you've only lit the kindling. Bring it on!

[[jonrev]]