Official Goliath Thread

[Jodon]

Here's the message I just wrote SFGAm about their new "walk back." I really hope they actually take the time to read my message and reevaluate their opening Goliath routine.

Hello,

I have visited Great America over 15 times in the last two seasons and have frequently arrived an hour before the park opens to get a ride on Goliath first thing in the morning. I arrived at the park yesterday to find out that a child was "trampled" in the daily run back to Goliath a few weeks ago and the management had implemented a new "walk back" procedure. While I understand that something had to be done after a child was "trampled," I encourage you to look to a different solution than the one you have implemented. This new "walk back" procedure did a very poor job of making your guests feel safer. While the "run back" might have been a little unruly at the beginning, it actually did a good job of spacing out the crowds and allowed for easy lining up of guests at the Goliath entrance.

The "walk back" was a case of semi-organized chaos for .44 miles. The "walk back" created an environment of a lot of people in a small space jockeying for position as close to the front of the group. Plus, the walkways vary in width, so when the walkway would get wider, the group would swell outward with people trying to get closer to the front. Then when the walkway became more narrow, the outward people would squish inward to keep their spots near the front. Again, it became very claustrophobic and felt very dangerous with an increased chance of being walked on or "trampled."

Once we neared the entrance for Goliath, it became a whole different kind of mess. Our guide for the walk back stopped us at the bridge outside the entrance for Loggers Run to reiterate her lack of tolerance for running. All the stop did was bolster up the anticipation for Goliath and create a more frenzied atmosphere at the entrance. We arrived at Goliath's entrance and it was a mess. Everyone in line started cramming in as close to the entrance as possible, then the security guard notified us that she wanted a single file line. As you can imagine, no one wanted to give up their spot near the front of the line, so making a single file line out of a large conglomeration of people at the entrance was not happening. All in all it was a really frustrating process that achieved the opposite result of making your guests feel safer and I was not the only person that felt that way around me.

Here are a couple suggestions to streamline the process a bit:
1. If you are going to have early entry for Gold Pass holders and Discover Card members, you can walk that group back before the rest of the crowds have entered.
2. Great America already hands out "deli-tickets" at the queue for Goliath, the deli counter could easily be brought up to the waiting area by the carousel and the tickets could be handed out there. After the "walk back" the guests could form a line in ticket order.
3. Instead of utilizing all of your security guards to guide a "walk back" you could have them dispersed along the route to ensure that guests are walking and not running.

Again, the current "walk back" did not achieve your goal of making your guests feel safer. Please reevaluate this procedure again and make the necessary changes to make your guests feel as safe as possible.

[CoasterDemon]

When I worked at Cedar Point (91-93) we would "greet" the guests at the chained/closed queue entrance to our ride (Blue Streak for me) with our candy cain (height measure stick). We would then unlock the chain and lead the single file line through the entire queue. No one could run past, and if someone was dumb enough to try to jump/run under queue rails, we were there to stop them (I don't remember anyone doing that during the morning opening; when we greeted the crowd/line of people, it was like being grand marshall.

The thing about Six Flags is training is gone. The people who work at the park sometimes do their best, but training has been a lost art. There is not much to pass down anymore. Smaller parks and Cedar Fair/Disney/Busch find something that works and stick with it forever. Six Flags has different rules and procedures every 5 minutes depending on who you ask, what ride you are at, etc. I think our park, Great America, is the best in the SF chain, but still WAY below the other parks operation wise.

[CoasterDemon]

oops double post

[BBH]

I was at the park today with two of my friends and they both comented on how slow the operations on Goliath can be. One of them even told me they should add another train (3 trains) to increase the capacity and I told him that that would make it WORSE!

It's physically impossible to run three trains on Goliath. There are only three blocks, and you'd need at the very least four in order to run three trains.

There's...

-Station
-Lift
-Transfer Track

Goliath's main magnetic brake run isn't a block, there are no friction brakes/wheels that would qualify it as such.

[Jodon]

I could be wrong, but doesn't the lift also function as a block?


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[BBH]

I could be wrong, but doesn't the lift also function as a block?


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Yep. Accidentally wrote "Block" instead.

Thanks for pointing that out.

[CoasterCale]

The Goliath crew (more like one in particular) got upset at me when I pointed out a flaw in operations. SR didn't open until noon and it's because I made a complaint that it still hadn't opened. So SR wasn't in operation until noon and empty seats were going by, so I stood by the exit and would fill them myself. After filling 6 empty seats in a row, one ride op told me I had to leave. I'm sorry that I used the rundown system to my advantage. Went to guest relations and got Green Exit Passes. I don't recommend anybody to try what I did but it worked for the time being.

[w00dland]

So you skipped hundreds of people waiting in line 6 times, got caught and then complained about it for exit passes?

There is so much wrong with that...I can't. You're what's wrong with America.

[ribsinbacon]

So you skipped hundreds of people waiting in line 6 times, got caught and then complained about it for exit passes?

There is so much wrong with that...I can't. You're what's wrong with America.

Keep in mind he's about fifteen years old... Security said a few weeks ago they're starting to crack down on single rider, and they're supposed to make you wait just as long as the rest of the line.


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[BBH]

^Except that's not how a single rider system is supposed to work.

[Jodon]

^^ and ^ No kidding. What is the advantage of using a single rider line if there is no advantage in wait time?

[Ace]

The Goliath crew (more like one in particular) got upset at me when I pointed out a flaw in operations. SR didn't open until noon and it's because I made a complaint that it still hadn't opened. So SR wasn't in operation until noon and empty seats were going by, so I stood by the exit and would fill them myself. After filling 6 empty seats in a row, one ride op told me I had to leave. I'm sorry that I used the rundown system to my advantage. Went to guest relations and got Green Exit Passes. I don't recommend anybody to try what I did but it worked for the time being.

Why do you think you are entitled to a single rider system? To abuse the system and then complain about it disgusts me. Not only should nobody else try it but you should be ashamed of yourself. This is whats wrong with younger enthusiasts these days. Way too entitled. Ill get off my soapbox now.

[DeathbyDinn]

^^ and ^ No kidding. What is the advantage of using a single rider line if there is no advantage in wait time?

The advantage is that it fills empty seats and helps capacity. It should help you get on faster, but that's not the reason why parks implement them. Single rider =/= fast pass.

[Jodon]

I know what the advantage is for the park, but if there is no advantage for the single rider, then there is no reason for a single rider to use it. That was my point.


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[BBH]

^^ and ^ No kidding. What is the advantage of using a single rider line if there is no advantage in wait time?

The advantage is that it fills empty seats and helps capacity. It should help you get on faster, but that's not the reason why parks implement them. Single rider =/= fast pass.

You're halfway right.

Yeah, the parks use them to fill empty seats. That is the point. But the other part of it is a lower wait time for people who want to be shoved into a seat next to a total and complete stranger. It's a system where both parties are supposed to benefit. Why would anyone use the single rider system if there's nothing in it for them?

[Dan The Coaster Man]

On Friday, Superman's line was about 2 hours. So my group of 6 all went the single rider line. And we were treated like a station wait. The Flash Pass guy right before the stairs allowed us to pass right away, and 2 of our 6 got on the first new train in the station, while the rest of my group got on the second new train, where there were still numerous empty seats, at least three. I did feel bad afterwards, we waited less than 5 mins for a 2 hour wait, but I guess that's what happened :/ later in the day, when I was actually alone, I tried Goliath's single rider line. The first two times, the flash pass guy said he had no lanyards. On the third try, he had about 3 lanyards left, and he told me that the wait for single rider was just as long as the actual line (1.5 or 2 hours). I couldn't think it was true... But then I realized it was 7 o'clock, so I left to get dinner with the dining pass before 7:30. Don't even get me started on that conflict *grunts, rolls eyes*

[CoasterCale]

I believe there is some assumptions going on about me. I didn't complain because I'm entitled, I complained because the capacity is bad as is. Letting empty seats go by isn't a good idea. I didn't cut anybody as I just filled them as it came naturally otherwise. As for crack downs, I'm always by myself and don't use them in large groups. I wasn't looking for a flashpass, as I've used SR many times before knowing I don't really save any time. I apologize that I love my homepark and would like to see it run better.

[BBH]

I was at the park today, and holy crap. The single rider system is absolutely pathetic.

They have at most ten lanyards. They wait for every single one to be used up before grabbing them and sending people up to the station. Making people wait longer for a single rider line defeats the purpose of having it in the first place.

On a more positive note, though, Goliath in the back seat is very good.

[CoasterMike]

I completely agree that the single rider line is a complete MESS!

[Guy_With_A_Stick]

If this crack down is on groups who abuse the Single rider line, then this is completely bogus. I always go by myself. And when I'm in a group, I wait normally in the stand-by line. This whole new crackdown is completely unfair to people like me. I think they should just ditch the whole Lanyard thing, have the other line to the station be exclusive to single-riders, and move all of the Flash Passes into the normal line before the stairs, and disability passes to the exit. It works fine on Superman and Bull, so I don't see how it wouldn't work on Goliath. End rant.

[tribar]

I believe there is some assumptions going on about me. I didn't complain because I'm entitled, I complained because the capacity is bad as is. Letting empty seats go by isn't a good idea. I didn't cut anybody as I just filled them as it came naturally otherwise. As for crack downs, I'm always by myself and don't use them in large groups. I wasn't looking for a flashpass, as I've used SR many times before knowing I don't really save any time. I apologize that I love my homepark and would like to see it run better.

I seriously can't believe they gave you exit passes.

[Dan The Coaster Man]

Today I was in line for a refill next to Goliath. I saw a group of six walk up to the entrance for Goliath and talked to the lady in charge, underneath the umbrella, you know what I mean. I couldn't hear the conversation and I know they didn't have a flash pass. The group turned around after a talk. So either the lady wouldn't sign a medical pass or she denied the group single rider line, which I think is the case.

I personally used the single rider right before that (I actually was by myself), and I waited about 30 mins. There was only one single rider in the single rider line ahead of me. The lady who was assigning rows was "eh". She assigned rows but people would move rows which caused gaps, and MANY groups of 4 were separated by at least one row of strangers. When their was a group of 3 or 5 or 7, She would assign rows. But then she would move down the line and ask for another odd numbered group to sacrifice one person for that single rider. I mean yes, every train was full, she did a great job at that. But it wasn't efficient, as almost every single group was seperated or broken. I mean if you go to a park, wouldn't you want to ride with all your friends/family together? In all honesty lines were so short I would've waited the same amount of time in the normal line.

[UWW-10]

I think they should just ditch the whole Lanyard thing, have the other line to the station be exclusive to single-riders, and move all of the Flash Passes into the normal line before the stairs, and disability passes to the exit. It works fine on Superman and Bull, so I don't see how it wouldn't work on Goliath. End rant.

Agreed! This worked really well for RC....I'm not sure why this is such a difficult concept elsewhere...wherever you decide to have the line for each ride, you fill seats as needed. As long as people understand that while it can reduce your wait in line, it doesn't allow you to pick where you ride and who you ride with.

[woohoodude11]

My old neighbor is at the park today and said something along the lines of the chain on the lift snapped and the ride will be down at least a week, any truth to this?

[Guy_With_A_Stick]

I think she's referring to the previous incident. If the chain did snap, then it'd take a LOT longer than a week. Look at Magic Mountain.

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