DeathbyDinn wrote:^ It might be a reasonably price option, but why on earth is it something the park would want? We already have two fantastic major wooden coasters. The next coaster we get should be something that fills a gap in our line up, not more of the same.
Where are these 2 fantastic wooden coasters you are talking about?
Have you ever ridden a GCI or Intamin prefab?
Please Great America, bring the iron horse treatment to Eagle.
I've ridden three GCIs, all of which are just ok. American Eagle could do with some retracking, maybe even some topper track on the helix, but it does not need I-box. It's a good ride, it's a classic wood coaster and it does not need changing.
xcheetaht wrote:Look, Six Flags Great America doesn't want to bring any rides back from other park(s). It prefers to get a new ride(s) every year.
Um, Chang? Revolution? Rolling Thunder?
You can add in Condor too.
"I've been staring at the world, waiting. All the trouble and all the pain we're facing. Too much light to be livin' in the dark. Why waste time? We only got one life. Together we can be the CHANGE. So go and let your heart burn bright"
2014/2015 - New Roller Coaster - Rumor - (2/4/13) I’m hearing early rumors that Six Flags Great America may be looking to add a launched roller coaster to the park’s lineup and has been looking over some ideas with Premier Rides. I’ve got a feeling the success of this may involve just how successful Full Throttle is at Six Flags Magic Mountain, so stay tuned.
xcheetaht wrote:2014/2015 - New Roller Coaster - Rumor - (2/4/13) I’m hearing early rumors that Six Flags Great America may be looking to add a launched roller coaster to the park’s lineup and has been looking over some ideas with Premier Rides. I’ve got a feeling the success of this may involve just how successful Full Throttle is at Six Flags Magic Mountain, so stay tuned.
This message is from Screamscape..
this rumor could somewhat be true because i see GA getting a launch coaster but there is still a whole season or two to go through to even find this out.
oh god I hope not. If it's anything like SFDK's, it will be a capacity nightmare. On a crowded day a ride like that at Great America would have a 2.5+ hour wait time.
"I've been told that some part of every wish will be heard but lately I lost sight of the truth in those words."
MForce4ever wrote:Ok but nobody has been able to yet refute that its a reasonable option which I'm sure is it a better price point then a new ride.
Land would be the issue. At park that is near it's breaking point on where they can build, where would it go?
MForce4ever wrote:They could fit it in Iron Wolf's spot.
monsterfan99 wrote:And even more so, you are already have a racing out-n-back, why buy one that has not ran in over 5 years? Get a GCII that takes up an ultra small footprint and does much more that the public wants.
What does the public want besides a new ride? If anything it might be a great marketing tactic to rebuild an old ride.
^You make a really good point. I worked at Cedar Point for two summers, so I totally know what I'm talking about, and it is totally possible. I also heard some rumors too.
Alexis wrote:^Crowded days are already going to have long lines anyway. So that really wouldn't matter as much
Yeah, but think about it, a long line at Bull moves faster than a long line at Superman, yes? That's what the term "capacity" means. Bull can easily take in 1000+ each hour while Superman averages in the 700's....With a good crew, Superman can handle 1000/hour, but I haven't seen that in a long time.
"I've been told that some part of every wish will be heard but lately I lost sight of the truth in those words."
MForce4ever wrote:If anything it might be a great marketing tactic to rebuild an old ride.
Sure, if it's a ride people care about. It worked great for Little Dipper since that was a ride people in the area grew up on. No one in the general public will give two craps if we save an old ride from another state. I just don't get why you want this to happen as it would add nothing to our line up.
As for something like S:UF at SFDK, Premier did say in an IAAPA video that a ride like that could have a duel station, so that could help. Still, unless they could do that as well as extend the trains or make them four across, I would rather see something like that go to a smaller SF park. But I would love something like Jokers Jinx or something like Blue Fire.
MForce4ever wrote:If anything it might be a great marketing tactic to rebuild an old ride.
Sure, if it's a ride people care about. It worked great for Little Dipper since that was a ride people in the area grew up on. No one in the general public will give two craps if we save an old ride from another state. I just don't get why you want this to happen as it would add nothing to our line up.
It would add nothing to our line up? Because a new, historical roller coaster adds nothing. Look at what Knoebels paid to relocate and rebuild Phoenix and Twister. Much more affordable than probably 90% of the brand new adult sized roller coasters on the market today. Add to that the built in marketing involved with rebuilding a historical roller coaster. Even if people had never heard of it, there would be a huge marketing push referencing the historical element of the exciting new roller coaster which would intrigue even average park goers. Any enthusiast who truly loves coasters would be beside themselves over SFGAm saving 2 classic woodies.
DeathbyDinn wrote:As for something like S:UF at SFDK, Premier did say in an IAAPA video that a ride like that could have a duel station, so that could help. Still, unless they could do that as well as extend the trains or make them four across, I would rather see something like that go to a smaller SF park. But I would love something like Jokers Jinx or something like Blue Fire.
Where would we fit an extremely pricy new launching coaster costing thousands a day in energy use alone? Besides that, casual visitors realized the similarities of Dark Knight and Ragin' Cajun, so I'm sure they would all see the similarities between a small launched coaster like S:Uf at SFDK and V2...
MForce4ever wrote:If anything it might be a great marketing tactic to rebuild an old ride.
Sure, if it's a ride people care about. It worked great for Little Dipper since that was a ride people in the area grew up on. No one in the general public will give two craps if we save an old ride from another state. I just don't get why you want this to happen as it would add nothing to our line up.
It would add nothing to our line up? Because a new, historical roller coaster adds nothing. Look at what Knoebels paid to relocate and rebuild Phoenix and Twister. Much more affordable than probably 90% of the brand new adult sized roller coasters on the market today. Add to that the built in marketing involved with rebuilding a historical roller coaster. Even if people had never heard of it, there would be a huge marketing push referencing the historical element of the exciting new roller coaster which would intrigue even average park goers. Any enthusiast who truly loves coasters would be beside themselves over SFGAm saving 2 classic woodies.
"Hey kids, come see an old wooden coaster from Ohio that you have never heard of!!!" There is zero local ties to the ride with the general public, which is the entire problem. Little Dipper had the ties of 3 plus generations where it was the first coaster they rode as a kid along with only taking up a plot of land the size of a go-kart track. Outside of locals to Geauga Lake and a few nerd/dorks (who think being an ace coaster classic = national landmark) the ride has no meaning. There is no money to be made off the ride or someone would have restored it in the last 4 years. Add to that there is another older wooden coaster here in FL in good shape waiting to be rebuilt in the Starliner.
MForce4ever wrote:It would add nothing to our line up? Because a new, historical roller coaster adds nothing. Look at what Knoebels paid to relocate and rebuild Phoenix and Twister.
Being historical doesn't make it a good ride. We already have two wood coasters, Big Dipper would just give the same experience on a smaller scale. And this is not at all like what Knoebels did because Phoenix was their first wood coaster, and Twister has a completely different layout and experience than Phoenix. If we didn't have any wood coasters, then I would like this idea. But we already have three, we don't need more of the same.
MForce4ever wrote:Even if people had never heard of it, there would be a huge marketing push referencing the historical element of the exciting new roller coaster which would intrigue even average park goers.
No, it wouldn't. The general public want tall, fast, inverting steel coasters. People even complained that X Flight wasn't tall or fast enough.
MForce4ever wrote:Besides that, casual visitors realized the similarities of Dark Knight and Ragin' Cajun, so I'm sure they would all see the similarities between a small launched coaster like S:Uf at SFDK and V2...
Sure, they would realize that they both launch, but that means about as much as realizing that Demon and Raging Bull both use chain lifts. An inverted shuttle coaster is different from a full circuit launch coaster.
DeathbyDinn wrote:Sure, they would realize that they both launch, but that means about as much as realizing that Demon and Raging Bull both use chain lifts. An inverted shuttle coaster is different from a full circuit launch coaster.
They'd also notice that they'd both have the slowest moving lines in the entire park (except Ragin' Cajun)
monsterfan99 wrote:"Hey kids, come see an old wooden coaster from Ohio that you have never heard of!!!" There is zero local ties to the ride with the general public, which is the entire problem. Little Dipper had the ties of 3 plus generations where it was the first coaster they rode as a kid along with only taking up a plot of land the size of a go-kart track. Outside of locals to Geauga Lake and a few nerd/dorks (who think being an ace coaster classic = national landmark) the ride has no meaning. There is no money to be made off the ride or someone would have restored it in the last 4 years. Add to that there is another older wooden coaster here in FL in good shape waiting to be rebuilt in the Starliner.
Why would they relocate the starlinier when it is all the way in FL. Big Dipper is 7 hours away in Ohio, is for sale at a great price point.
DeathbyDinn wrote:Being historical doesn't make it a good ride. We already have two wood coasters, Big Dipper would just give the same experience on a smaller scale. And this is not at all like what Knoebels did because Phoenix was their first wood coaster, and Twister has a completely different layout and experience than Phoenix. If we didn't have any wood coasters, then I would like this idea. But we already have three, we don't need more of the same.
So where is our classic out and back wooden coaster? And let me direct your attention perhaps to SFStL whom have 3 adult sized wooden coasters.
DeathbyDinn wrote:No, it wouldn't. The general public want tall, fast, inverting steel coasters. People even complained that X Flight wasn't tall or fast enough.
So I'm assuming you work in the market research department in an office who looks at statistics and patterns with customers? I'm impressed you have time to be posting on a fansite of the place you work for. Unless that's not your job, in which case you would have no clue what the public wanted for fact. Well unless you've otherwise conducted independent market research in which case I'd like to see the facts that back your claim up. Otherwise what you're claiming is your opinion, which, might be wrong. I'm only stating my opinion by talking about the big dipper, but I don't care if I'm wrong.
DeathbyDinn wrote:Sure, they would realize that they both launch, but that means about as much as realizing that Demon and Raging Bull both use chain lifts. An inverted shuttle coaster is different from a full circuit launch coaster.
So a single gimmick would make rides distinguishable? I'm sure that's why Ragin' Cajun, which SPINS as it's single gimmick and Dark Knight which is INDOORS as it's single gimmick aren't distinguishable to the public who have repeatedly made the comments about their similarities.
MForce4ever wrote:So where is our classic out and back wooden coaster?
American Eagle.
MForce4ever wrote:And let me direct your attention perhaps to SFStL whom have 3 adult sized wooden coasters.
I never said there was anything wrong with having three wood coasters, I said theres a problem with having three of the same type of wood coasters. Screamin' Eagle is an out n' back, Boss is terrain, and America Thunder is a twister. I've ridden all three and all three provide different rides.
MForce4ever wrote:Unless that's not your job, in which case you would have no clue what the public wanted for fact. Well unless you've otherwise conducted independent market research in which case I'd like to see the facts that back your claim up.
Seriously? All you do have to do is look at the thousands of comments left on parks facebook pages or the comments on youtube videos. It doesn't take a genius to figure out that the general public want everything to be bigger and badder. Where's YOUR proof that the general public want Big Dipper?
MForce4ever wrote:I'm sure that's why Ragin' Cajun, which SPINS as it's single gimmick and Dark Knight which is INDOORS as it's single gimmick aren't distinguishable to the public who have repeatedly made the comments about their similarities.
If you actually read what I said, I said the general public WOULD be able to see the similarities between V2 and a different launch coaster. What I said is just because both rides launch, it doesn't mean they'd provide the same experience as an inverted shuttle coaster, is different from a full circuit launch coaster.
monsterfan99 wrote:"Hey kids, come see an old wooden coaster from Ohio that you have never heard of!!!" There is zero local ties to the ride with the general public, which is the entire problem. Little Dipper had the ties of 3 plus generations where it was the first coaster they rode as a kid along with only taking up a plot of land the size of a go-kart track. Outside of locals to Geauga Lake and a few nerd/dorks (who think being an ace coaster classic = national landmark) the ride has no meaning. There is no money to be made off the ride or someone would have restored it in the last 4 years. Add to that there is another older wooden coaster here in FL in good shape waiting to be rebuilt in the Starliner.
Why would they relocate the starlinier when it is all the way in FL. Big Dipper is 7 hours away in Ohio, is for sale at a great price point..
$65,000 gets you the ride itself as exposed to the elements for the last 4 years. Add to that they must take down the ride, which will cost more than a couple of dollars. At the very least the total cost would go above $4 million (using Zippin' Pippin' as an example) and require removal of other attractions in the park to do so (which also cost money.) Maybe it's me but $4-$5 million for a coaster well past it's prime is a giant waste of money.
DeathbyDinn wrote:No, it wouldn't. The general public want tall, fast, inverting steel coasters. People even complained that X Flight wasn't tall or fast enough.
So I'm assuming you work in the market research department in an office who looks at statistics and patterns with customers? I'm impressed you have time to be posting on a fansite of the place you work for. Unless that's not your job, in which case you would have no clue what the public wanted for fact. Well unless you've otherwise conducted independent market research in which case I'd like to see the facts that back your claim up. Otherwise what you're claiming is your opinion, which, might be wrong. I'm only stating my opinion by talking about the big dipper, but I don't care if I'm wrong.[/quote] Look at the coasters built in this country in the last 25 years, that is all the proof you need. If you want more, look at the lines of rides like Raging Bull, B:TR, S;UF or even Whizzer to the wooden coasters of the park. Heck, if anything build more water park rides if you really want to know what the public wants. Look at the lines at Holiday World in the afternoon for a water slide vs. The Voyage.
DeathbyDinn wrote:Sure, they would realize that they both launch, but that means about as much as realizing that Demon and Raging Bull both use chain lifts. An inverted shuttle coaster is different from a full circuit launch coaster.
So a single gimmick would make rides distinguishable? I'm sure that's why Ragin' Cajun, which SPINS as it's single gimmick and Dark Knight which is INDOORS as it's single gimmick aren't distinguishable to the public who have repeatedly made the comments about their similarities.[/quote] I've heard many folks say that about American Eagle and Viper as well. To them a wooden coaster is a gimmick and they are all the same.
MForce4ever wrote:So where is our classic out and back wooden coaster?
American Eagle.
Come on, you know racing is another gimmick.
DeathbyDinn wrote:
MForce4ever wrote:And let me direct your attention perhaps to SFStL whom have 3 adult sized wooden coasters.
I never said there was anything wrong with having three wood coasters, I said theres a problem with having three of the same type of wood coasters. Screamin' Eagle is an out n' back, Boss is terrain, and America Thunder is a twister. I've ridden all three and all three provide different rides.
Ok then a racing, a twister and an out and back shouldn't be a problem right?
DeathbyDinn wrote:
MForce4ever wrote:Unless that's not your job, in which case you would have no clue what the public wanted for fact. Well unless you've otherwise conducted independent market research in which case I'd like to see the facts that back your claim up.
Seriously? All you do have to do is look at the thousands of comments left on parks facebook pages or the comments on youtube videos. It doesn't take a genius to figure out that the general public want everything to be bigger and badder. Where's YOUR proof that the general public want Big Dipper?
I never claimed to have any proof of anything, as previously stated I'm just throwing my opinion out there.
DeathbyDinn wrote:
MForce4ever wrote:I'm sure that's why Ragin' Cajun, which SPINS as it's single gimmick and Dark Knight which is INDOORS as it's single gimmick aren't distinguishable to the public who have repeatedly made the comments about their similarities.
If you actually read what I said, I said the general public WOULD be able to see the similarities between V2 and a different launch coaster. What I said is just because both rides launch, it doesn't mean they'd provide the same experience as an inverted shuttle coaster, is different from a full circuit launch coaster.
Is an indoor mouse a different experience than a spinning mouse? Is a standard SLC a different experience than a Batman clone? Do guests see the similarities? Does it stop them from spending their money at the park?
monsterfan99 wrote:"Hey kids, come see an old wooden coaster from Ohio that you have never heard of!!!" There is zero local ties to the ride with the general public, which is the entire problem. Little Dipper had the ties of 3 plus generations where it was the first coaster they rode as a kid along with only taking up a plot of land the size of a go-kart track. Outside of locals to Geauga Lake and a few nerd/dorks (who think being an ace coaster classic = national landmark) the ride has no meaning. There is no money to be made off the ride or someone would have restored it in the last 4 years. Add to that there is another older wooden coaster here in FL in good shape waiting to be rebuilt in the Starliner.
Why would they relocate the starlinier when it is all the way in FL. Big Dipper is 7 hours away in Ohio, is for sale at a great price point..
$65,000 gets you the ride itself as exposed to the elements for the last 4 years. Add to that they must take down the ride, which will cost more than a couple of dollars. At the very least the total cost would go above $4 million (using Zippin' Pippin' as an example) and require removal of other attractions in the park to do so (which also cost money.) Maybe it's me but $4-$5 million for a coaster well past it's prime is a giant waste of money.
Oh so relocating/rebuilding an old wooden coaster is a giant waste of money? We better tell Bay Beach, Knoebel's, Great Escape, SFNE, Frontier City and SFA they wasted their money.
DeathbyDinn wrote:
DeathbyDinn wrote:No, it wouldn't. The general public want tall, fast, inverting steel coasters. People even complained that X Flight wasn't tall or fast enough.
mforce4ever wrote: So I'm assuming you work in the market research department in an office who looks at statistics and patterns with customers? I'm impressed you have time to be posting on a fansite of the place you work for. Unless that's not your job, in which case you would have no clue what the public wanted for fact. Well unless you've otherwise conducted independent market research in which case I'd like to see the facts that back your claim up. Otherwise what you're claiming is your opinion, which, might be wrong. I'm only stating my opinion by talking about the big dipper, but I don't care if I'm wrong.
Look at the coasters built in this country in the last 25 years, that is all the proof you need. If you want more, look at the lines of rides like Raging Bull, B:TR, S;UF or even Whizzer to the wooden coasters of the park. Heck, if anything build more water park rides if you really want to know what the public wants. Look at the lines at Holiday World in the afternoon for a water slide vs. The Voyage.
Right because I've never seen Viper or American Eagle have a long line
DeathbyDinn wrote:
DeathbyDinn wrote:Sure, they would realize that they both launch, but that means about as much as realizing that Demon and Raging Bull both use chain lifts. An inverted shuttle coaster is different from a full circuit launch coaster.
mforce4ever wrote:So a single gimmick would make rides distinguishable? I'm sure that's why Ragin' Cajun, which SPINS as it's single gimmick and Dark Knight which is INDOORS as it's single gimmick aren't distinguishable to the public who have repeatedly made the comments about their similarities.
I've heard many folks say that about American Eagle and Viper as well. To them a wooden coaster is a gimmick and they are all the same.
So these people tried both rides even though they seemed similar in nature? well it seems like they would probably try another one then.
Goku1910 wrote:I like that rant. But I doubt that will put the Big Dipper whining to rest....
If I'm whining, than you're being a b*tch by trying to sneak in snide comments as if your opinion is more valid than others. (and b*tching about me expressing my opinions).
Don't get me wrong. Big Dipper should be saved. But I don't think it's a smart choice for Great America. Spending that much on a old ride is outright stupid. You could build a much better GCI instead. Big Dipper has had no maintenance at all. The wood is water treated, but that's not going to last forever. The longer it sits in that abandoned lot the more it decays. It would be just like Little Dipper, it would probably need all brand new wood (or most of it). Now that's not cheap.
I don't know people have been living under a rock or something, but GCI's are "The next big thing" in Wooden Roller Coasters.
Try to put yourself in the shoes of the people who have Six Flags St. Louis, would you be pissed if your park advertised a old ride as new? I would be.
"I've been told that some part of every wish will be heard but lately I lost sight of the truth in those words."
