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New Theme Park puts SFGA at Risk

Talk about anything that has to do with the amusement park industry here.
Postby Necropolis on August 2nd, 2017, 4:13 pm
Just as the name of the thread describes. Anyone aware of this? Apparently there's going to be a theme park and water park megacomplex about an hour from SFGA. Customers from the NY/NJ/CT tri-state area would need to drive right past this new complex and continue 1 hour to reach Great Adventure. This new park is extremely close to downtown New York which makes me wonder how much revenue SFGA would lose. The fact that the 'American Dream' theme park with shopping destinations is much closer to major metropolitan areas could be seen as a major plus by many.

The megapark will include:

- 8.5 acre Nickolodeon Universe indoor theme park
- 6 acre Dreamworks indoor water park
- 4 acre, 16-story indoor ski & snowboard park
- 1.8 acre KidZania (mini-city theme park for kids age 3-10)
- Sea Life Aquarium
- Legoland Discovery Center
- a 65k sqft venue for live concerts
- Minigolf, Ice rink, observation wheel etc.
- Integrated mall & restaurants with 2.7m sqft GLA (huge!), including Saks, Hermes, a Hard Rock Café, Lucky Strike Bowling/arcade/restaurant, and celebrity chef concepts.

https://seekingalpha.com/article/408995 ... flags-risk
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Postby staticshadows on August 2nd, 2017, 4:24 pm
Here is the quote from the transcript of the Six Flags Q2 2017 Earnings Call.
https://seekingalpha.com/article/4090929-six-flags-entertainment-six-q2-2017-results-earnings-call-transcript
Christopher Prykull - Goldman Sachs & Co.

Great. And then Jim, you had mentioned earlier sort of one of the strengths of the amusement park space or the regional space is sort of limited capacity growth over the past 5 or 10 years. Is there any park or leisure projects that are either under way or potentially in the planning stages that you are keeping an eye on that could potentially have an impact on Six's attendance at existing parks?

James W. P. Reid-Anderson - Six Flags Entertainment Corp.

I have to tell you Chris, we keep an eye on everything, we watch. As a good managing team, it's our job to make sure we know what's going on in our local markets. Because the truth is that other theme parks are not really our competitors. There are other activities that provide an alternative for people who would come to theme parks. And our goal is to take that – we want as much a share of people's wallets as we can get. So there is nothing out there that is concerning us.

I will address head-on what I think is the source of your question which is there was a recently announced news that came out about some park opening in the Meadowlands. And the reality is that this project is in essence, a mall that happens to have a ski slope, a small kids' park and is absolutely not in competition with anything that we do at any of our parks including Great Adventure. Very small in scale, indoors, not comparable.

And I think it's remarkable if you pull up and you look at the last 20, 30 years, there hasn't been a successful new theme park that has opened in the whole United States at all. In fact, the ones that have opened have pretty much crumbled. So this market is as rock solid, bullet proof as it gets. And if there is someone coming at us, that will open up a park next door or close by, we'll have four to five years to be able to prepare for that. But there is zero on the horizon right now.
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Postby Ilovthevu' on August 2nd, 2017, 5:02 pm
I think it would hurt Great Adventure a little bit. The guy seems super arrogant that this is not going to happen. This is an indoor amusement park planned like the Mall of America. An indoor amusement park can be open all year. I'm not going to say that Great Adventure would lose a million people because of this amusement park but if it's a great amusement park, it will cut into Great Adventure's attendance. I think the guy is bogus saying that he will build another amusement park if this park opens. Yeah, right.

Kentucky Kingdom was closed down by Six Flags. Kentucky Kingdom has added a bunch of new rides, and is a new park compared to what it was before. Kentucky Kingdom is not crumbling. Luna Park in New York is a new park, and is not crumbling. Santa's Village in dundee closed down, and got rid of all their rides. Than, a new company bought some of those rides back, and bought some other rides. It's not crumbling that I know of.

Honestly, if the Mall of America was in IL closeby, I would buy a season pass (if they offered it) because they have a Tony Hawk coaster, swings, KMG Afterburner, a Euro Fighter, a good themed log ride, a smaller version of V2 / surf board ride, bumper cars, a dark ride, and a ferris wheel.
Last edited by Ilovthevu' on August 2nd, 2017, 5:21 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby staticshadows on August 2nd, 2017, 5:18 pm
The transcript for Cedar Fair's Q2 2017 Earning Call is transcribed poorly with lots of errors, but if you listened to the call, Matt Ouimet mostly agreed with Jim Reid-Anderson's statement.
https://seekingalpha.com/article/4093905-cedar-fairs-fun-ceo-matt-ouimet-q2-2017-results-earnings-call-transcript?part=single

Barton Crockett

One other thing I’d just, bigger picture wondering if you could address. One of the fundamental investment theses for the group has been that there’s not really construction of meaningful new theme parks happening, hasn’t been happening for a long time. No sense of that’s changing right now. I think there’s been some discussion from other quarters arguing that that's so much of baloney in fact, there’s meaningful new construction to pointing some Legoland development, some parks coming back to Houston, shopping malls in New Jersey.

I was just wondering if you could give us a supply and issue in this group, is it an advantage relative to others? How would you describe the supply to dynamics and theme park industry at this point?

Matt Ouimet

It’s a fair question, Barton, and I’d like to turn baloney, I’m not sure what to do with it. But it doesn’t mean the industry as long as anybody in the regional music park industry, and I do know that the barriers to entry are real. I think you could see a couple of difference. Lego is probably the most likely to occur assuming that it can get through the zoning but it’s also evidence of how difficult it is to get something done.

There’s been the rumor mill about, I think it’s called Green Land in New Jersey, at the Middle Land park. That’s been out there for a long time. I can’t tell you the probability of those at this point in time, but history would tell you not only is it difficult to get one up, it's difficult to make one successful.

So I don’t really, at least for our portfolio, I don’t worry about those elements. Candidly, one of our most successful parks is the second most competitive park in the country which is not very far, it’s Southern California. But I would not be shorting a stock simply because they’re talking about Greenland at New Jersey.
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Postby Ilovthevu' on August 2nd, 2017, 5:31 pm
I know they are talking about from the ground up parks, but that guy (Cedar Fair guy) even brings up another new park, and that was Legoland in Florida that is lasting. It seems people are so worried about the 2 parks that failed (Kansas one & Hard Rock Park) that they are forgetting about the amusement parks that closed down, and than someone put a lot of money into them, and made them open up again / "new" again.
Last edited by Ilovthevu' on August 2nd, 2017, 6:09 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Morals of life - Take my advice - You don't know what you have till it's gone. & Buying stuff doesn't fulfill your happiness levels for long. You buy stuff. You use stuff. You get bored of stuff. You throw stuff out. It's old. You buy new stuff. You use stuff. Get out of the rut.
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Postby staticshadows on August 2nd, 2017, 5:59 pm
Ilovthevu' wrote:I know they are talking about from the ground up parks, but that guy (Cedar Fair guy) even brings up another new park, and that was Legoland in Florida that is lasting. It seems people are so worried about the 2 parks that failed (Kansas one & Hard Rock Park) that they are forgetting about the amusement parks that closed down, and than someone put a lot of money into them, and made them open up again / "new" again.

I just think that Anderson guy sounds scared about a new park. You don't just open a new park just because you have competition. He says one thing, and if that park opens up, he wants to do another thing? Oh, it's just a kiddie park. No affect at all to Great Adventure. Though, if that park opens up, you betcha we are going to open up another park. Maybe, that's why he left the first time.

Legoland New York was mentioned, not Legoland Florida. Nothing was mentioned about Six Flags opening a new park in response to competition, I have no clue where you pulled that one from.

Keep in mind American Dream is a luxury mall that will target a different type of customer than Six Flags and the season passes are going to be priced much higher than Six Flags.
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Postby Ilovthevu' on August 2nd, 2017, 6:09 pm
"And if there is someone coming at us, that will open up a park next door or close by, we'll have four to five years to be able to prepare for that."

I misread it. I read it, if someone is coming at us, we will open up a park next door or close by, and we'll have four to five years to be able to do it.. Oops.
Morals of life - Take my advice - You don't know what you have till it's gone. & Buying stuff doesn't fulfill your happiness levels for long. You buy stuff. You use stuff. You get bored of stuff. You throw stuff out. It's old. You buy new stuff. You use stuff. Get out of the rut.
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Postby CoasterRiderSC on August 3rd, 2017, 8:33 am
Does anyone remember Old Chicago? I went there as a kid. It was an indoor amusement park attached to/contained within a mall. Our park basically put that place out of business. We keep talking about running out of space at our park. How much more limited in space would an indoor amusement park be, surrounded by tons of anchor stores and other stores??

I'm thinking that maybe this new park they're talking about is more of a threat to other kids-only parks?
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Postby FParker185 on August 3rd, 2017, 4:09 pm
Old Chicago was in Bolingbrook and had no Anchor stores. Actually that's the reason they closed
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Postby CoasterRiderSC on August 4th, 2017, 8:02 am
FParker185 wrote:Old Chicago was in Bolingbrook and had no Anchor stores. Actually that's the reason they closed


Wasn't the plan to build anchors there but it never happened??
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Postby FParker185 on August 8th, 2017, 4:39 pm
Nope....

http://www.negative-g.com/old-chicago-a ... -index.htm

http://www.defunctparks.com/abandoned/i ... -illinois/

Also one of my High School science teachers was actually the mayor of Bolingbrook at the time and gave the order to bulldoze the abandoned mall
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